I totally agree with you on fairness … but if you (read an affiliate) can’t get your surfers to sign up for recurring - but only for a trial - then it is fair that you only get paid for that trial.
I you can entice surfers to go for recurring (and there are many ways to do that - good examples are review sites) - then you should get paid for that too if the program offers that.
But - without me being nasty now (really) - just a question to Basschick.
I had a look at musclebucks - the site manofmuscle.com looks very, very good - the whole tour looks great … very nice for affiliates … no leaks etc - the join page looks good too! (- but it does NOT tell the surfer it is recurring billing - nor that they have to cancel 7 days in advance before they get billed again - I find that a tiny bit of a let down - and not really fair …)
ALSO - if a surfer decides not to join today - but comes back in 4 days - only remembers menofmuscle.com and goes there … and sees a link for muscle porn …
Who exactly gets paid for this code? the affiliate or someone else?
as i understand it, my surfers can cancel the same day and not be rebilled - or at least that’s what i was told. also i see some cancelling on the day before who don’t get billed. i believe - and i could be wrong, so i hope that ccbill can shed some light here - that the 7 day thing is to cover asses.
i could go on for days about ways that program owners and affiliates are unfair to each other - after over 12 years in the industry, and several years closely reviewing literally thousands of paysites, i’d have quite a list, but this thread was about one issue that imo is both unusual and unfair from sites that got affiliates to send traffic by NOT offering non recurring trials, then added them after they got all their affiliates to send traffic.
this wasn’t a thread about fairness to affiliates - it was a thread about a single issue, and i feel that you’re trying to change the focus. but i believe the answer is no, affiliates won’t get credit. considering that over 75% of our sales are from affiliates, and almost every sale we make ourselves is from pages we can track outside the tour, my best theory about how this works out is that anyone sending steady traffic to a site will end up losing some sales from guys they send who sign up 5 days later but they’ll also gain some sales from surfers interested in the niche who had originally gone to the site 5 days before from a different affiliate. btw, as an affiliate i have sent traffic to hundreds of ccbill sites that use the standard 3 day cookie and it doesn’t bother me or seem to affect my bottom line. but maybe that’s just me. if it bothers you - and since you don’t send traffic as an affiliate, i can’t see why it would except perhaps very abstractly - please start a new thread about it or join these threads http://www.gaydemon.biz/search.php?searchid=17761
which have already discussed the issue.
I can’t follow the logic, since I would like to believe that a member would come back to us in the future simply because they remembered the site, but many members will return via a different affiliate link. Not all of them by any means, but a pretty good number of them.[/QUOTE]
Wait to you have about 120 days of data. You may change your mind. I would say the vast majority return because they liked your site the first time and have it bookmarked. You should be seeing a huge amount of members returning within a week after their membership expired. If you have a transparent tour, then ex-members will be bookmarking the site and returning after each update. When they find one they like, they will join another one month non recur and the loops continues.
I do think it is really bad form when a sponsor adds non-recurring without telling existing affiliates.
I am afraid however that affiliates will indeed see this happen more - and will have to put up with it … simply stopping promoting websites will not work - you end up with none - and as we speak - every day new affiliates join the web -ready to take your place.
I wonder if the sponsors are scared of the credit crunch and have done preemptive moves to still get revenue … “it is better to get $10 for a non-recurring, than not getting $20 recurring members”
Could it also be that sponsors saw memberships grow, but revenue fall because the $ devalued that much last year? And want to give more options for Americans who wouldn’t want to pay the "expensive Euros and Pounds? (I can remember getting £1 for $1.40 - now I get £1 for almost $2) - i.e. giving them a non-recurring option.
How about webmasters feeling they are just more fair to surfers? Transparency when it comes to billing - no hidden charges … I think we have all been stung by $1 memberships - which actually ended up being $99 - and being so difficult to get rid of - that you ended up canceling your credit card. That has put so many people off porn … with non-recurring the surfers have no worries.
Also some webmasters know surfers come back when they want - and pay again. They might see the list of updates and only want to join when they see a guy they like - again good for non-recurring.
The adult business on the net is changing - sponsors have to compete very hard with lots of sites that cost them revenue (torrent and tube sites). Imho - some affiliates AND sponsors have helped getting these tube sites off the ground … and now we all have to pay for it …
So that are a few reasons why I think non-recurring will be on the rise.
I think it’s important to remember that the affiliate/sponsor relationship is a symbiotic one with great benefits to both sides.
Tube sites and torrents are taking money out of everyones pockets and hurting the diversity of content available in the long run. Remember the boring 90’s porn with the same few big studios charging up the bum for just one video? I see us headed that direction as the big players are the only ones that can afford to sue those stealing from them.
The types of affiliates are just as diverse as the types of sponsors currently so you should be able to find people willing to play by your rules and make money with you.
As for $1.95 trials, I will have to defer to others. I would never whip it out* for $1.95.
There was a very tense exchange at an InterNext seminar on affiliates regarding the ways in which sponsors do or do not use the huge PPS. I thought they were gonna knock each other out.
This is a transparent tour + pictures. Think about it for a sec. I send a surfer to the site. There is a 3 day cookie. Now go surfing through the tour. There are 1,000s of FREE pics. What will a surfer do? Bookmark it and probably join long after the cookie has expired.
BlakeMason has a transparent tour. What you see on our tour is what you get in the member’s area. I believe you do as well. If http://manifestmen.com/preview-men-of-manifest.cfm updates as your site updates, then you are transparent.
Transparent tours get bookmarked as they have content that is changing. So, someone with little interest in joining the site when he first hits it, may bookmark as he knows he will see something new.
BTW, I agree with the 1.95 model. To make that work you need to do sneaky X-sells and many big companies have 10+ merchant accounts just to manage the risk.
Got it. This is were we show what is inside. http://ManifestMen.com/preview-manifestmen-videos-updates.cfm We try to give them a pretty clear idea, but 1000’s of pictures? I don’t know that I could do that. But that is kind of like sites that say “20 NEW CLIPS ADDED THIS WEEK” when really it is one video that has been cut up into five 2 minute parts in two formats. Hell if that was acceptable we could say 24 new clips added EACH WEEK.
But to bring that back, if they don’t want Mom or BF or Wifey to know where they have been, they delete EVERYTHING after each viewing session hence bye bye cookie
okay, fetishlad - i pm’ed dean from ccbill this question:
and he responded:
so there you have it - i’m not tricking or misleading my members nor is anyone else using ccbill. it appears that the terms are just there to cover everyone’s ass just in case something goes wrong.
[LEFT][SIZE=2][SIZE=2] 5. Automatic Recurring Billing (If Selected By You On The Sign Up Page) [/SIZE] [/SIZE]
[SIZE=2][SIZE=2] As determined by the content provider of the site, subscription fees may be automatically renewed at the end of the original term selected, for a similar period of time, unless notice is received from the subscriber seven (7) days before renewal. All special introductory offer Members shall be exempt from the 7 day notification requirement, but subscriber must notify CCBill directly 24 hours prior to the end of the trial/special offer period in order to cancel automatic renewal. All trial/special offer memberships shall renew at the stated membership rate. The maximum term of this agreement is 100 months.
Unless and until this agreement is cancelled in accordance with the terms hereof, subscriber hereby authorizes CCBill to charge subscriber’s chosen payment method to pay for the ongoing cost of membership. Subscriber hereby further authorizes CCBill to charge subscriber’s chosen payment method for any and all additional purchases of services and entertainment provided by the site.[/SIZE] [/SIZE][/LEFT]
So he does not know what is in their terms page … or he does and will use it for - well what exactly?
And Bass … you are bound by their rules - so you can’t help it of course … I don’t think you would make a problem out of anyone wanting to cancel when they decide to …
fetishlad, those terms are there to cover their ass - and ours. i’ve talked to several people from ccbill about it AND i’ve seen many of my members cancel the day before they were due to rebill and not be rebilled.
