View Full Version : Why don't Macs get viruses...
gaydemon_jr
11-30-2009, 11:47 AM
...or is this a myth?
Google didn't come up with any reliable links to info.
Jasun
11-30-2009, 12:03 PM
The system is a bit more difficult to get things installed but it's also that macs are so much smaller a market and the owners tend to be a bit less gullible in clicking those "WIN FREE GAS FOR A YEAR CLICK HERE@!" banners that lead you to sites that infect you with every worm in history.
gaydemon_jr
11-30-2009, 12:05 PM
Those who buy them perhaps aren't so gullable. I bought my boyfriend a Macbook Pro so he can study for promotion, but he is VERY likely to click those ads haha!
camcruise
11-30-2009, 12:07 PM
The system is a bit more difficult to get things installed but it's also that macs are so much smaller a market and the owners tend to be a bit less gullible in clicking those "WIN FREE GAS FOR A YEAR CLICK HERE@!" banners that lead you to sites that infect you with every worm in history.
What he said...Second it.
rawTOP
11-30-2009, 12:27 PM
It's not impossible for a Mac to get a virus, but it's far more difficult. Back just before the Internet became possible Microsoft was pushing technologies that were big on distributed computing and integration of applets that actually ran on different computers. They pushed hard for software as a service and because they were primarily running in secure corporate environments they didn't really think about the security implications of all those application hooks in an insecure environment. Then the Internet got big and Microsoft was left with a big "kick me" sign on their ass in the form of lots of insecure hooks to "share" data and application services. Worst, they didn't take the Internet seriously - they didn't even get into web search or build a web browser for quite a while. Then they did finally get into it but saw it as an extension of all of those "software services" they were promoting - so they enabled all those insecure hooks in IE - and once there people depended on them, but they were also cursed by them in the form of viruses.
The history of the Mac is very different. It never got wide acceptance in corporate America and so Apple didn't try to meet their demands for software as a service. They put out a few things that were sorta jokes, not taken seriously and are long since dead. Then the best move was that they completely scrapped their OS and built a completely new OS (OS X) with a BSD Unix core. BSD was well hardened and trusted on public servers - it had security built into it's core, which was never the case with Windows. They continued that focus on security and just never opened up the types of holes that Microsoft opened up.
So generally, on a Mac to get a virus on your computer you have to manually download it and run it as an application. That's very different than Windows where you could hit a web site and a software service would run automatically and install the virus on your computer without you even knowing anything happened. Windows also has backdoors which allow computers on the same network to find each other and exchange information. That means once a virus gets installed it could infect other computers on the same network very easily. On the Mac that's all an automatic process - not an automatic one.
So in a nutshell, Windows has more viruses because for a long time they didn't take security seriously because they assumed they'd be running in a secure corporate environment. Apple picked BSD as their core after it was clear the Internet was a big thing and security was important - so on a fundamental level OS X is far more secure and will be for years to come.
The other issue is that people writing viruses pick the biggest target. Why write a virus for an OS that so few people use? There's also distain in the hacker community for everything Windows and respect for everything Unix. But still, I think whoever writes the first really big Mac virus will get serious credibility in the hacker world - but that time hasn't come yet.
basschick
11-30-2009, 01:51 PM
as RawTOP says, i'd guess it's because PCs are the biggest target. macs get less viruses 'cause there's less of them. after all, wordpress gets LOTS more hackers successfully exploiting it than, say, linkx.
RDude
11-30-2009, 03:07 PM
Worst, they didn't take the Internet seriously - they didn't even get into web search or build a web browser for quite a while. Then they did finally get into it but saw it as an extension of all of those "software services" they were promoting - so they enabled all those insecure hooks in IE - and once there people depended on them, but they were also cursed by them in the form of viruses.
I have always wondered if MS plays a hand in the whole anti-virus need. If what you're saying is fact, there would be nothing stopping MS from keeping the security holes open in order to see a revenue from the anti-virus purchases. This might be paranoid thinking, but I have pondered it many times. :rolleyes: It certainly wouldn't surprise me at all.
Daniel
12-01-2009, 04:43 AM
The other issue is that people writing viruses pick the biggest target. Why write a virus for an OS that so few people use? There's also distain in the hacker community for everything Windows and respect for everything Unix. But still, I think whoever writes the first really big Mac virus will get serious credibility in the hacker world - but that time hasn't come yet.
This I would expect to be one of the main reasons.
This I would expect to be one of the main reasons.
What I've always been told, too.
I do have Norton Antivirus for my Mac, never really finds anything. However, my Mac is maybe 4 years old now PowerMac G5, doing some odd things, this and that more and more, hope it survives until I can afford a new one. Apple Store Genius Bar is no help and has misdiagnosed my Mac several times in the past. If I had a pc, my instinct would be to wonder if my computer caught a virus of some kind. But I guess not (?).
So Macs do screw up even if not for viruses, or at least mine does. Mine needs to be looked at.
zbuckz_lloyd
12-01-2009, 08:09 AM
This may seem bad, but I don't have virus protection on my MAC. woof!
This may seem bad, but I don't have virus protection on my MAC. woof!
Lloyd, I am really wondering if it's worth it. Doesn't seem to do anything and the scan takes forever.
rawTOP
12-01-2009, 09:23 AM
This may seem bad, but I don't have virus protection on my MAC. woof!
As long as you consistently apply Apple's security updates - that's all you need. The anti-virus software pretty much just checks for PC viruses which can't hurt you anyway...
As long as you consistently apply Apple's security updates - that's all you need. The anti-virus software pretty much just checks for PC viruses which can't hurt you anyway...
rawTop, I do you think maybe it's worth just deactivating my Norton Antivirus on my Mac because:
1. It presumably isn't needed.
2. Maybe the application is cause some of the slowness or who knows what with my Mac (or maybe not...it's more than slowness sometimes).
I meant..."Do you think....?" (not "I do you think")
rawTOP
12-01-2009, 10:22 AM
I meant..."Do you think....?" (not "I do you think")
I would. I have Mac web servers with no virus protection. The virus protection caused more problems than it solved.
I hope this isn't speaking prematurely. I just uninstalled my Norton Antivirus completely. Had to restart, which went somewhat slow...not too bad, but thought...oh great, did nothing.
Then I got on the web, things are snappier than they were. I can now view videos on sites that I previously couldn't, if I am reporting correctly. It's only been ten minutes but I feel like my Mac somehow became alive again. If this is true, Norton Antivirus made it sick!
I am so lucky to have discussed this with you rawTop, thanks.
I would. I have Mac web servers with no virus protection. The virus protection caused more problems than it solved.
camcruise
12-01-2009, 09:20 PM
I hope this isn't speaking prematurely. I just uninstalled my Norton Antivirus completely. Had to restart, which went somewhat slow...not too bad, but thought...oh great, did nothing.
Then I got on the web, things are snappier than they were. I can now view videos on sites that I previously couldn't, if I am reporting correctly. It's only been ten minutes but I feel like my Mac somehow became alive again. If this is true, Norton Antivirus made it sick!
I am so lucky to have discussed this with you rawTop, thanks.
That Norton Antivirus is not worth the disc it is printed on. RT is right about that.
Do you ever do a Disk Utility?
I do one if my Mac is running slow.
It helps speed things up.
basschick
12-01-2009, 09:25 PM
norton has the same effect on pc's. it's like it chokes the life out of computers :-/
That Norton Antivirus is not worth the disc it is printed on. RT is right about that.
Do you ever do a Disk Utility?
I do one if my Mac is running slow.
It helps speed things up.
I will make a note of this, Disk Utility, thanks.
Maryflixxx
12-02-2009, 08:48 AM
Most of the virus writers are crazy linux guys, too, and Mac is basically a linux platform, so there is a mutual respect between the two groups.
But I think it's a saturation thing.
I was reading an article from a Mac guru that stated that he believes that when Apple hits 16% market share, virus will be developed targeting them as well.
I also think it is a QA issue at microsoft - for example their latest fuck up, the "Black Screen of Death". I wonder, do they even have QA?
Yes, I think it is only time before Macs gets whacked. Actually they do have some baby viruses out there, but supposedly virtually nothing.
Beyond this issue, I personally hope that the PC and Mac world get their fights and issues over with and make computers that are truly compatible with each other, because this whole thing is getting so silly. Both PC and Mac have great things to offer. If computers could be made to take the best parts of both and drop negatives of both, that would make communication and lives much easier.
Gaystoryman
12-02-2009, 10:15 AM
Yes, I think it is only time before Macs gets whacked. Actually they do have some baby viruses out there, but supposedly virtually nothing.
Beyond this issue, I personally hope that the PC and Mac world get their fights and issues over with and make computers that are truly compatible with each other, because this whole thing is getting so silly. Both PC and Mac have great things to offer. If computers could be made to take the best parts of both and drop negatives of both, that would make communication and lives much easier.
Would be nice, but it isn't about making our lives easier, or better, but about making profits, at any cost, quality just being one of the sacrificial lambs. whistle
kinsey
12-02-2009, 02:15 PM
I have been using mac almost exclusively since the 90's and remember in the days of the "classic" OS how apple used to offer a $10,000 reward to anyone who could hack into their mac. When I am surfing around and click on something I shouldn't have I always breath a sigh of relief when I see that it was a .exe file. I don't know a lot about programming but a do know that a .exe file won't run on my mac.
I am often thing about how to play practical jokes on the guys that I work with and realize how easy it would be to get someone to click on a cleverly crafted applescript or, I guess, some other kind of Unix shell script. I think when the crackers finally put their minds to it, us mac users are going to be caught with our pants down. Then we will all go scrambling for some protection. But I'm content to wait til someone reports a malicious mac virus in the wild before I bother adding Norton or some equivalent. I just hope that we find out about it in the news before we get hit by it.
To be sure, it'll be big news and quickly reported, unless Macintosh has some might power to hush it, but I doubt that.
I just hope that we find out about it in the news before we get hit by it.
TropixxxMichael
12-02-2009, 06:20 PM
I have always suspected that Apple employs the worlds top virus people just to make viruses for PC's so that Mac's look better. ;o)
But yeah, I have ALWAYS been a Mac person, since the 80's, and I have never had a virus that I know of, nor do I run any virus software of any kind on my new Mac's.
I suspect that someday we will be hit with some sort of virus, but until then, I do not worry, I just back my shit up almost every night. If I upgraded my OS, I would use Time Capsule and do it every night, but I have an older version of Final Cut Pro and After Effects that I do not want to have to rebuy. So for now, manual backups about once a week.